The House Stocking No-No List.

Nigel · Post by **Nigel** » Thu Jan 13, 2005 6:33 pm

1: Chems

Yes, people still do it, stock their house with posionous chemicals, their character drinks them, and he/she dies, and then they ask "Why did I die?"

Somebody, please warn newbies.....

Post by **DeVice** » Thu Jan 13, 2005 7:05 pm

I think it was...

2: Explosives (for the very same reason, but replace "drinks" with "eats").

Nigel · Post by **Nigel** » Thu Jan 13, 2005 7:40 pm

DeVice wrote:I think it was...

2: Explosives (for the very same reason, but replace "drinks" with "eats").

Boom.

Morli · Post by **Morli** » Thu Jan 13, 2005 9:14 pm

Um, why is the game coded to recognise chemicals and explosives as food anyway? The very fact that it knows to drink chemicals, and eat explosives, as opposed to being random, means that they are registered as food and drink, so why not deregister them?

If food/drink is a boolean value, well, the 8086 architecture processes boolean as 8-bit variables, so just give them an invalid code.

Post by **DeVice** » Thu Jan 13, 2005 9:20 pm

I actually did set it myself to be that way some long time ago.
I can nearly remember my evil grin when setting the explosive huge negative hunger change triggered by the eat action.

Damnit, do you want to spoil my fun ?

To be more serious, well, that kind of "side effect" gives the game its unique touch. IMO. Not that i'm sure it's all positive. But i like it

Post by **DeVice** » Thu Jan 13, 2005 9:25 pm

[off topic]

Morli wrote:If food/drink is a boolean value, well, the 8086 architecture processes boolean as 8-bit variables, so just give them an invalid code.

I thought this was a C/C++ thing, not related to the architecture, that booleans actually are short ints (or bytes, dunno) ?

I bet this is your attraction for buzzwords, Morli, that made you talk too fast

[/off topic]

Nigel · Post by **Nigel** » Thu Jan 13, 2005 9:51 pm

a bool can only hold 2 values can't it?

Mattizme · Post by **Mattizme** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 8:43 am

Nigel: Yes, in Cpp. From my limited knowledge, computers do craazy shinola when u compile ur Cpp code to do with binary and assebly and stuff, and I can't really see TRUE fitting into binary

Plus, keep explosives dangerous - to be honest, anyone silly enuf to stock explosives in their house deserves to die

Maybe we need a 'fridge' section of house inventory, a 'house' section, and maybe a 'garage' section? that way people can keep their porsches, explosives and chemicals out of the fridge

zaroba · Post by **zaroba** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 11:34 am

an island owner could easily rename some inedible items to chemicals and explosives and use them instead of the regular chemicals and explosives. would solve the whole eating/drinking problem. i had done that in zoric 7. no clue why no others though.

hedgehog · Post by **hedgehog** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 12:22 pm

i actually quite like the feature. zar's use of it in the latest zoric was a creative example of how it's prolly handy we keep 'em around.

that said:

an island owner could easily rename some inedible items to chemicals and explosives

did i just agree wholeheartedly with zar?

Morli · Post by **Morli** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:28 pm

DeVice wrote:[off topic]

Morli wrote:If food/drink is a boolean value, well, the 8086 architecture processes boolean as 8-bit variables, so just give them an invalid code.
I thought this was a C/C++ thing, not related to the architecture, that booleans actually are short ints (or bytes, dunno) ?

Boolean are 8 bit variables by virtue of how the 80x86 chips process data. The processor is designed utilising Type D flipflop circuits in arrays of eight (like a transputer for those technically minded). Even if you pass a 0/1 variable to it, 2nd and 3rd gen compilers are designed to interpret that as an 8-bit value, as the processor will interpret it as 8 bits, even if only one is used.

Nibbles - 4 bit variables - were used at one point, but again,k these typically used bitshifting on larger 8 bit variables. There is no efficiency reason to use those now.

DeVice wrote:[off topic]
I bet this is your attraction for buzzwords, Morli, that made you talk too fast
[/off topic]

Talk too fast? Umm, wha?

Ghelna8 · Post by **Ghelna8** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:34 pm

DeVice wrote:To be more serious, well, that kind of "side effect" gives the game its unique touch. IMO. Not that i'm sure it's all positive. But i like it

I prefer the rather unique touch of beer on health.

Seriously though, I don't see why food and drinks can't be customisable. It would be useful for world owners to customise exactly the benefits/ disadvantages of edibles. It wouldn't make loading worlds any slower, as that information isn't increased, just changed.

Morli · Post by **Morli** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:40 pm

There's really no necessity to load world information more than once anyway, unless the world version has changed, so in the long run. Would it really matter how much information was necessary to connect to a world?

Post by **Magicfinger** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:42 pm

really must finish this and commit to CVs soon

zaroba · Post by **zaroba** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 4:18 pm

you mean you've been working on it without letting us know? shame on you
MagicFinger was flogged by zaroba.

with it changable it could really increase realism. could have stuff like Potatoe Chips that decrease hunger, but slightly increase thirst. or more then just chems and explosives that hurt you.

Post by **DeVice** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 5:21 pm

Morli wrote:Boolean are 8 bit variables by virtue of how the 80x86 chips process data. The processor is designed utilising Type D flipflop circuits in arrays of eight (like a transputer for those technically minded). Even if you pass a 0/1 variable to it, 2nd and 3rd gen compilers are designed to interpret that as an 8-bit value, as the processor will interpret it as 8 bits, even if only one is used.

Yaha ! let's start a war ! *getting out his flaming codesword*

Probably depends (I'm all talking without an idea how it's actually done here) on implementation.
CPU knows nothing about what a boolean is, it's the langage above that transmits it data (yeah in 8-packs of bits) and ask it to do some comparizons.
Supose the langage take care of zeroing non-significant bits in booleans before making the operations on it. Can we still say it's 8-bits data ?
And another possibility : you can actually transmit some 1 bits values to the cpu (setting one bit in the flags register for instance, say, sign). It may be possible that code use that feature to deal with booleans, no ?

Anyway, i was just attempting to point at your habit of getting into deeply technical considerations until nobody here really keep an idea of what your talking about. Looks like I just motivated you to give us some more

Morli · Post by **Morli** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 5:47 pm

Please reread my previous post. It answers the question in it

Morli · Post by **Morli** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 6:24 pm

However, it would be unfair not to clarify (this post follows a rant/explanation in another topic, so I have calmed down aa bit since posting above).

We still say it is 8 bits of data, even if the other seven are zeroed - they HAVE to be, otherwise we risk utilising the existing status of the flip-flops. As a coder yourself, you know what that means.

All 8 are used, at specific states. A boolean is either 00000000 or 00000001 - the full eight. There is nothing to stop us defining a value of 00000010 as an additional option for the boolean when we send it to the ALU. All eight are data, as they are all required for it to work - the 80x86 - founding CPU design for all PCs - 80186, 80286, 80386, 80486, 80586, 80686 etc, works on multiples of eight. If you try to process any less at a time, you recieve no speed benefit.

And I am sorry, if my technical comments are too in depth for others here. To me, this is elementary knowledge. I tend to forget that others might not have the same background. I am used to being around highly technical, highly intelligent people. Sorry.

I promise I will include lots more explanation in my technical posts here from now on.

Post by **DeVice** » Fri Jan 14, 2005 11:21 pm

Morli wrote:I am used to being around highly technical, highly intelligent people. Sorry.

I just hope you don't assume those two higher heights usually comes together. Considering myself inclined into the first group, but far from the 2nd one.

Reminds me of a conversation i had with an old school friend that i hadn't met for years :

Fr. - So, yeah, i have turned into a truck driver, what've you become yerself ?
Me - Well, i am working with computers, especially programming.
Fr. - Ah. Yeah. What does that mean ?
Me - ... Well, i tell the machine, errr, what it has to do, uummm, s'not easy to describe, ... (blushing 'cause was assuming everyone has an idea about that)

Morli · Post by **Morli** » Sat Jan 15, 2005 9:32 pm

DeVice wrote:
Morli wrote:I am used to being around highly technical, highly intelligent people. Sorry.
I just hope you don't assume those two higher heights usually comes together. Considering myself inclined into the first group, but far from the 2nd one.

No, I don't assume they come together. I was just cursed / blessed with that as my usual type of social group - the ones I have least trouble fitting in with.

I was cursed with a waaay above average intelligence myself, and trust me that that is not necessarilly a good thing.

(heh, it also puts dates off a bit, more often than not, when you can out-geek them. lol)